Legit Hoon Stat's

[LTDHO]

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,2359...036-421,00.html

HOON cars are being seized at the rate of 50 a week with hot-headed drivers forced to pay more than $1 million so far to get their machines back.

Bendigo is Victoria's hoon capital and the Commodore the car of choice, latest police figures show.

Victorians will be urged to dob in dangerous drivers by calling Crime Stoppers with specific tips about local hoons, feeding a police intelligence database that will track the road menaces under a $250,000 scheme.

Of the 2600 cars impounded between January and December last year, 27 were locked away after police caught their drivers smashing the speed limit at more than 200km/h.

Road safety groups want Victoria to consider LA-style "crush-them" laws where serial hoons have their cars destroyed and a video of the demolition is posted online as a warning to others.

Traffic police have wielded their new confiscation powers with devastating force since the law came into effect 18 months ago. The figures show:

HOLDEN Commodores accounted for 837 seizures, ahead of Ford Falcons (220).

SOME revheads lost luxury cars such as Ferraris and a Lamborghini.

BENDIGO easily topped the list of hoon hotspots with 90 cars seized, followed by Mildura (44) and Geelong (43).

AT LEAST 44 per cent of hoon drivers were P-platers.

OF THE 1235 drivers charged for improper use of a motor vehicle, 830 were performing burn-outs while almost 300 were sliding over the road doing "fishtails".

Hoons lose their cars on the spot for two days when they are booked for a first offence.

Cars are impounded for three months for a second offence and indefinitely for a third strike.

Before they can retrieve their cars, drivers have to reimburse police the cost of towing and storage - $300 on average.

Since the laws took effect in July 2006, police have seized 3437 cars, which means hoons have copped a $1.03 million hit to the hip pocket.

NSW considering road safety groups' call to crush hoon cars

Road Trauma Support Group Victoria chief Julie Parke said the crushing scheme, with better education, was worth considering.

"These drivers are raising the bar all the time and that is dramatic, so maybe it needs a commensurate response that is dramatic too," she said.

Citizens Against Road Slaughter spokesman Colin den Ronden said destroying a hoon's prized possession would send a strong message.

The concept is being considered by the NSW Government. But the Victorian Government has ruled out crush-them laws, saying it prefers to sell serial offenders' cars and spend the money on road safety campaigns.

About one per cent of drivers caught in Victoria - or 120 - are repeat offenders.

Fewer than five cars have been forfeited to the state since the scheme began.

'Dob-in-a-hoon' campaign to begin soon

Insp Tom McGillian, from the vehicle impoundment support unit, said the high number of P-plate hoons was disturbing.

He warned that even the most minor error of judgment by a hoon driver could be fatal.

Insp McGillian said the dob-in-a-hoon campaign would start early this year.

"There are a number of council-run hotlines but we are in the process of establishing a model for this inside Crimestoppers," he said. "Intelligence will be collected and sent out for action by police."

On Thursday, police confiscated a motorcycle from a 33-year-old Bundoora man caught speeding at more than 200km/h on the Wallan-Whittlesea Rd.

A 19-year-old man on a P-plates spent the new year without his Commodore after he was caught speeding at 156km/h in a 100km/h zone on New Year's Eve.

Police Minister Bob Cameron said the anti-hoon laws were effective.

"The hoon laws take away the one thing these people care about, their cars."

Most cars were impounded between 4pm and midnight, and one in five cars was locked up on a Saturday.

Under a law introduced in November, any driver who leads police on a pursuit can have their car confiscated.

[someLS1]

Stupid police targeting us respectable holden drivers lol those numbers make it clear to me that no one gives a shit and will rip skids no matter wat the police does hence they should legalise burnouts and therefore making the world a safer place.. makes sense to me!

[[Sterling]]

bloody holden drivers ruining it for all us ford drivers....^^ its only illigal if you get cought and if your stupid enough to in traffic then so b it.. but speeding is stupid there should harsher punishments for , but doing a little slide in the wet or dry should be a slap on the rist or a fine(a hefty fine) none of this take your car bullshit.

[EFFalcon]

burnouts and fishtailing 99% of the cases... not so many for drag racing

[Rollin]

Insp Tom McGillian, from the vehicle impoundment support unit, said the high number of P-plate hoons was disturbing.

He warned that even the most minor error of judgment by a hoon driver could be fatal.

BBQ? 'the high number of P plate hoons was distrubing' - it's 44%....which, and bugger me if I'm wrong, means that 56% of people busted were not P platers...

And the second line? Puh-leeze. The most minor error of judgement at any time, any place, any where could be fatal when you are driving a car, you don't have to be doing dumb shit.

I can't remember the numbers but I'm pretty sure the road toll didn't drop at all last year, even though they have all these new super harsh hoon and speeding laws. That indicates to me that 'hooning' is not the problem, and that the main problem is people need to learn how to goddamn drive, and pay attention to the road when doing so.

Does anyone know where I can get a .50 cal sniper rifle? I think it's time to send these wankers a message.

[LTDHO]

Insp Tom McGillian, from the vehicle impoundment support unit, said the high number of P-plate hoons was disturbing.

He warned that even the most minor error of judgment by a hoon driver could be fatal.

BBQ? 'the high number of P plate hoons was distrubing' - it's 44%....which, and bugger me if I'm wrong, means that 56% of people busted were not P platers...

44% are approx 18 to 21
56% are approx 22 to 30 to 40 to 50 to 60

44% is hell of a lot!

Does anyone know where I can get a .50 cal sniper rifle? I think it's time to send these wankers a message.

LOL - sounds good to me...

[someLS1]

I can't remember the numbers but I'm pretty sure the road toll didn't drop at all last year, even though they have all these new super harsh hoon and speeding laws. That indicates to me that 'hooning' is not the problem, and that the main problem is people need to learn how to goddamn drive, and pay attention to the road when doing so.

Thats exactly fuckin right its all revenue raising bs i know skids can be annoying to old people! but id like to see some stats of people actually dying doing a burnout!... besides not doing burnouts is unaustralian as far as im concerned

[Revengelane]

Road safety groups want Victoria to consider LA-style "crush-them" laws where serial hoons have their cars destroyed and a video of the demolition is posted online as a warning to others. Road Trauma Support Group Victoria chief Julie Parke said the crushing scheme, with better education, was worth considering.
Citizens Against Road Slaughter spokesman Colin den Ronden said destroying a hoon's prized possession would send a strong message.

This is a positive note.....NOT. What the **** are these clowns on about.......fucken crushing cars, warning to others (fucken poofs) the only thing this will accomplish is more bad relations between police and hoons (or whatever wording they want to use). Next headline will be all police DIE at the hands of hoons for crushing cars.

DIE, DIE, DIE, DIE, DIE, DIE and when you are dead DIE some more fuckwits.

[Malakai]

More rhetoric that's all it is. Giving them alternative places to do burnouts and such at a reasonable price is the answer. These laws are worth heaps more money than solving the problem so that is what we get.

[holmsy]

i actually had a customer at work say her son did a 30ish meter burnout and killed a girl. i assume it span around or something.
but yes they do put alot of emphasis on speeding when clearly speeding isnt the thing most "hoons"are booked for

[pHaT`eL]

I wish they would stop with the young people being hoons. At least most know there doing it.
I dont know how many times you get a little old lady or old man doing 20-30km under oblivious to whats going on around him, almost like a mobile road block. That to me is more dangerous.

Never going to win these battles anyway. Maybe when our generation ends up old they will pick on older drivers.

[holmsy]

unfortunately when our generation ends up older it will still be the same sort of idiots in charge.

[Rollin]

besides not doing burnouts is unaustralian as far as im concerned

DIE, DIE, DIE, DIE, DIE, DIE and when you are dead DIE some more fuckwits.

Damn straight.

[EFFalcon]

44% are approx 18 to 21
56% are approx 22 to 30 to 40 to 50 to 60

44% is hell of a lot!

Depends how you look at it.
Police will target P Platers
Police will be more harsh on P Platers
Police are more likely to give NON-P Platers a warning or ignore the non-p plater and nab the p-plater doing the exact same thing right beside him.

Statistics only show what the Police have acted on, who knows who they've let off.

[Bipolar]

Most of the above posts are on the money. Look into the speeding stats further, and you'll see there aren't many collisions where speed is the ONLY factor. Speeding + drinking, speeding + drugs, speeding + peer pressure, speeding + unroadworthy vehicle (eg tyres), speeding + fatigue, speeding + tailgating etc etc etc.

I think they focus on speed coz its the easiest to "deal with". Its easier to sit on the side of the road and catch someone speeding than it is to drive around in traffic pulling people over for tailgating. Imagine a world with no multi-car pile-ups. LOL

[Eb Barbie]

Wish they would stop targeting P platers. There are non-p platers which are worse in alot of cases. I still think once you get to like 50/60 you should be eye/ear tested etc. Dunno how many old people I seen way under the limit or driving with their indicator on by mistake

[Bipolar]

+1. That's why I have 2 stepsisters and a stepbrother with no mum.

[Airved]

I think it' s all BS. Taking someones property away from them because they abused the laws provided for using it. Maybe if cars were paid for by the Government, the Government could confiscate and/or destroy them after inappropriate use. I paid for my car, I'll do whatever the hell I want with it.

The sad thing is, there wouldn't be enough support to prevent these rules coming in. Theoretically, no one should take any sort of risks on the road, but if we want to, it should be up to us. If we want to take our cars to an isolated area and get up to mischief, that should be our right. I'd only support the idea of hoon laws if they were being enforced on drivers who took these risks in populated locations, e.g. a suburban street.

I think a far better revenue raising idea would be to (like many have said) build a playground for hoons - big open spaces for burnouts, drift courses and dragways. It would be a guaranteed income source and they could incorporate hoon laws into it by banning anyone caught being a 'hoon' outside the designated area. Only once they've offered a decent way to PREVENT hoon driving, they can look at ways of STOPPING hoon drivers.

[BlackED_Sprint]

lets face it, what this alls boils down to, if you look at the figures, is that 'hooning' doesnt kill people.... its being a shit knut behind the wheel and not knowing what your doin and pissed kents that kill people.

its peoples ability to judge and react to situations that causes most accidents. you cant name one minority group or another as the culprit, its just that half the kents on the road dont know what to do if shit goes pear shaped, so they panic and get fucked.

i still stand by the fact that drunk drivers are fools (and mainly young dudes which fuks our reputation) and cause their fair share of fatalities. driving is gnarly fun, drinking is gnarly fun, but doing both together is like playing with dynamite.... you just might get fucked.

there needs to be more adequate training done before people get their licence (devensive driving courses etc) which could maybe also be a requirement for people that have car accidents in which they are clearly in the wrong.

just some ideas people, illl get off my soap box now.

[pHaT`eL]

Something I find rather amusing is the stats table in Saturdays Herald Sun that accompanies the hoon article.

What Hoons are doing

Burnouts - 67.3%
Doughnuts - 3.7%
Fish tails - 22.5%
Monos - 4.8%
Wheelies - 1.7%

Now heres there descriptions for these activities..

Burnout: A stationary car's tyres are spun until they generate smoke
Doughnut: Swinging a car around in a circular motion so it leaves a rubber skid mark and generates smoke
Fishtail: Handling a moving car in such a way that its rear slides from side to side
Mono: A motorcycle wheelstand
Wheelie: A car rearing back on two wheels

That might not amuse you, but to know 1.7% of people caught where in cars launching that hard makes me laugh!

[[Sterling]]

what you dont do that pete?? i do it all the time on the way ta work me mum hates it !! lol funny but!!! haha

[SHY4D]

may have been mentioned before, but confiscate drink drivers cars, they're just as dangerous. suspending there license for a month does shit, why not take there cars to. Repeat drink drivers....crush there cars.

my two cents

Go Geelong, were up there.....and thankfully i ain't one of the 43

[Rollin]

IT took just five hours for the first road carnage newspaper headline to appear at the start of the 2007 Christmas-New Year holiday period.

South Australian police operating a random breath testing station. Picture: Brenton Edwards
A man was killed when a stolen car crashed at an intersection during a chase in Melbourne at 5am on December 20.
And so it began: the parade of news presenters, police using words such as slaughter and issuing pleas to slow down, and graphic images of mangled wreckage, sobbing relatives and friends, and flowers laid at crash sites.

Properly analysed, road death toll figures demonstrate there is an extraordinary lack of debate about the real reasons behind fatalities and injuries in crashes. An examination of the figures shows that with all the speed and red light cameras, anti-alcohol measures, vehicle safety, improvements, road upgrades, street lighting and big spending on creative advertising over the past five years, the death toll has largely plateaued. Over that period total national vehicle registrations (adjusted for deregistered vehicles) have risen from 13.162 million (10.365 million of them passenger vehicles) to just over 14.8 million (11.51 million passenger vehicles). During 2007, an average of 9200 new (and safer) vehicles came on to the roads every month.

Data shows Australia has been very good at reducing road trauma. The death ratio per 100,000 population has been about the same for the past five years. Injury totals have declined significantly because of vehicle impact performance, faster paramedic response and more effective medical intervention. As a result, holiday road trauma does not justify the alarmist treatment it gets or the authorities' shock-horror rhetoric.

Figures from the federal Australian Transport Safety Bureau show that for several years state authorities have set the Christmas-New Year holiday period at 13 days (in Victoria in 2007 it began at midnight on December 20 and ended at midnight on January4). In 2006, the last full year for which ATSB figures are available, 62 people died: drivers, passengers, motorcyclists, cyclists and pedestrians. That represented an average of 4.7deaths a day. The same figures show that for the entire year, deaths averaged 4.38 a day and the most lethal weekly period year-long is Friday to Sunday, when there is an average of 5.4 deaths a day. For the five days of Easter 2007, there were an average of five deaths a day.

It shows during holiday periods roads are no more dangerous than on the average weekday, and certainly safer than during normal weekends. And this is despite the diluting holiday logistics of extra distances covered, heavier traffic, bigger passenger loads, unroadworthy vehicles, drivers not used to distance driving, greater stress, more distractions and increased alcohol consumption.

Of 1000 drivers stopped for random breath-testing, two or less per 1000 tested positive (over .05) and 65 per cent of those tested between .05 and .08, according to Australia's data bank of driver blood-alcohol content, now the longest-running and most detail-rich in the world. A three-week blitz by Victorian police in the first three weeks of December2007, yielded 989 positives out of 192,000 tests: a little less than 2per cent.

All ordinary fatal crashes (can there be such a thing?) are attended by local police, not an elite crash investigation unit. So the death of a lone driver on a straight country road against a tree, in the absence of any obvious evidence of alcohol, drugs, another vehicle or braking marks, leads police to tick the box marked speed. Never mind that it could be caused by 30,000km-old windscreen wiper blades crazing the windscreen, bald tyres, scored brake discs, no seatbelts or even a huntsman spider falling into the driver's lap from a sun visor.

Excessive speed is a simple reason commonly cited to explain a very complex problem. There is no single reason for a crash. Every crash is the result of a series of tumblers falling in the wrong sequence. Multiple-death crashes are extremely rare occurrences. However, no official will admit that factors such as vehicle roadworthiness, road engineering or maintenance, weather, or even untimely text messaging could be significant factors.

US National Health and Traffic Safety Administration researchers produced a survey of fatal crash data that found excessive speed to be a small or negligible factor. It blamed driver inattention, "failure to see", and loss of control as by far the commonest causes.

When 50 people died in the 1997-98 Victorian Christmas-New Year holiday period (which began that year on December 18), the government convened an immediate road safety summit. After meeting for one hour, the participants announced an extension of the zero blood-alcohol limit to the first three years of a licence and the suspension of the licence of any driver exceeding a speed limit by 20km/h. Their perspicacity was reinforced by a senior police officer, who used the much-run television footage of a red Falcon wagon that had been parked that holiday under a Hume Highway overpass and whose four sleeping occupants had been decapitated by a semitrailer, to demand compulsory five-hour rest stops for drivers and, further, the mandatory use of crash helmets for all passengers.

About the same time the NSW Stay Safe Committee recommended that as most deaths happened on two-lane country roads, all overtaking on such roads should be banned in the state. Common sense prevailed in that case. In November 2004, Victorian premier Steve Bracks called for car speedometers to be capped at 130km/h. The motor industry considered it the stupidest idea ever suggested.

In 2002, Victoria followed New Zealand and Britain and painted a number of police road patrol cars in garish colour schemes. Police responded by hiding them in scrub and behind buildings to set up speed traps. (I watched a thick scrub set-up on the Princes Highway book almost 100 bike riders in 90 minutes as they returned north from the Australian Grand Prix on Phillip Island).

And so the road safety lie has been embedded, preying on road users' perceptions that if they don't drink and drive, or exceed the speed limit, they will be safe from the depredations of crazed drivers.

It reinforces the common feeling that if an act is made illegal, it will fix things. However, people will always ignore what they perceive as bad or unenforceable laws: tailgating, failure to keep left, the use of mobile phones and (in some states) the suspension of dangly objects from the rear vision mirror.

Several surveys have confirmed more than 30 per cent of drivers continue to drive while disqualified. Speed cameras can't stop that.

Yet, even as state governments project traffic infringement revenue into annual budgets, they continue to insist that fixed and mobile cameras - euphemistically called safety cameras - are located in black-spot zones and not used for revenue raising.

In 2005, NSW, which posts signs warning of fixed speed cameras, issued about 550,000 traffic infringement notices. Victoria - with fewer drivers, far less road surface mileage, and no such signposting - sent out 1.07 million; 82 per cent of those were for speeds less than 15km/h over the limit. Apart from a relative handful of cameras policing 40km/h school speed zones, the vast majority are placed on roads with high traffic volumes.

In May 2005, the South Australian Government announced it would spend $35.6 million of its road safety budget of $60 million on 50 new red light intersection cameras, adding to the 12 existing cameras that in their first year of operation in 2004 generated $11 million in revenue. Yet the Government's official figures showed that over the previous eight years, disobeying traffic lights had caused only 1.34per cent of fatal crashes.

Victoria Police runs almost 300 fixed speed and red light cameras, estimating that about three million vehicles are tabbed every month. Yet so far Victoria Police and its enforcement partners, VicRoads and the Traffic Accident Commission, have refused to reveal any detail of the infringements from the new average speed traps set on both three-lane sides of the Hume Highway early in 2007. These set-ups measure average speeds up to 72km/h into and out of Melbourne, issuing fines for speeds averaging more than 3km/h over the limit over distances as short as 3km. There are no notices warning hapless interstate drivers.

Emphasis in all Australian states has shifted from surveillance and visual deterrence to speed measurement, as if this is the main crash factor apart from alcohol.

The overemphasis on speed as a factor justifies government investment in ever more sophisticated technology to trap more vehicle users; in fact, government polling shows this gives voters a nice warm feeling because the authorities are seen to be doing something. Thus, as mobile road patrols vanish, we are losing the ability to check on the use of phones, suspended licences, outstanding warrants, underage drivers, the wearing of seat restraints, lane discipline, tailgating, unroadworthy vehicles and the rest.

No longer do police sit and watch for those rolling through stop signs, as they did in the 1970s, nor can they lurk at railway level crossings to stop the growing incidence of vehicle-train crashes. They can't. They simply don't have the manpower, or are diverted to more revenue-worthy pursuits.

There are calls for more transparency and more rational debate on new ways to lower road trauma, apart from the standard techniques of more disinformation to justify more technology and greater punishment.

The all-states Australian Transport Council created by the Howard government in 2000 as part of a road safety strategy set a target to cut road deaths by 40 per cent by 2010.

On New Year's Eve, Australian Automobile Association chief executive Mike Harris told The Australian: "Unless something serious is done, we've got no chance of reaching that 2010 target. In terms of the national road safety strategy target, we're actually going backwards when you look at the statistics."

And, based on the statistics, that "something serious" could well be understanding that the huge emphasis on speeding and drink driving may even be counterproductive. Anecdotal evidence suggests that 95 per cent of people don't exceed speed limits and even fewer drink and drive. So their belief is that if they avoid those offences, they don't have to pay much more attention to being safe or driving carefully.

Bill Tuckey is the former motoring editor of BRW and former editor of Wheels magazine.

[syko4d]

i think the best answer and simplest one ,

except it wont make the government money, wich it could if they were smart and not dickless retards,

is give us somewere to do it after that be as harsh as you want,

but all there doing now is making every one hate cops so much more,

aww poor piggies i can see more dead C U N T-STABLES

[LTDHO]

I paid for my car, I'll do whatever the hell I want with it.

Are you for real?

I think a far better revenue raising idea would be to (like many have said) build a playground for hoons - big open spaces for burnouts, drift courses and dragways. It would be a guaranteed income source and they could incorporate hoon laws into it by banning anyone caught being a 'hoon' outside the designated area. Only once they've offered a decent way to PREVENT hoon driving, they can look at ways of STOPPING hoon drivers.

That's a smarter idea, it has been said for years, the money they make of steet activities should build and run an off street venue.

[Eb Barbie]

I think making more places/'playgrounds' for people to hang out and have fun with their cars is a great idea! Was at those meetings with a few people from here to get one built around tooradin/cranbourne area. The come back they have is that people will practice on the streets and still 'hoon' anyway. Which in a way, is kinda true.

[Airved]

That's where the government can incorporate their anti-hooning rules. By simply forwarding on the registration details of any car caught hooning on public roads to a legal 'hooning' venue, cops can teach people a lesson that if they abuse their right to do it in a legal and controlled environment, they lose it.

I know being banned from the track wouldn't concern everyone out there doing burnouts, etc., but say, a couple of months banned at the track, a small fine (maybe double the cost of entry to the track) and a demerit or two could make a decent warning. Second offence, lic. suspension/fine/demerits. On the third offence, tow the car, suspend car for a few months, then charge for impounding and possibly send it over the pits for inspection (possibly even cancel rego on it). Anyone caught after a third time probably deserves to have their car crushed for being a 'tard.

I haven't given it too much of a thought, it was just as an example of what they COULD do. Maybe my ideas for punishment are harsh or too lenient, but I don't see why you'd have to drive recklessly on an open road when a safe, legal environment is provided for you. I know I wouldn't wanna risk losing any of those things. I'd just pay whatever the entry fee is and burn rubber legally.

If they built one here in Canberra, it would be excellent. Create jobs - security/doormen/food&drink vendors, etc. Build a dyno-track, performance parts centre and servo too all around the grounds. You'd make a killing.

[Daniel88]

All adds up to one thing (If you ask me) Money money money (all the fuzz want)

[nothin suss]

I think as soon as this 'dob in a hoon' thing comes in we will be seeing heaps of Geminis and Old corollas with welded diffs and big exhausts... Just like the good old days! Im currently searching fo a RT142 2.4 injected corona, they are the shit!

[AaronEF8]

Ya know, speed is a factor in 100% of crashes.

Bill Tuckey is a legend, I have read a lot of great articles by him on road deaths. Notice he doesn't use the word 'accident' ? Thats because accidents don't happen on the road, crashes and collisions do.

There's a couple extra things that need to be added to that article. When SA changed the urban speed limit from 60 to 50, there was a 53% INCREASE in fatalities in the 50km/h zones that year.

When the US dropped the law about 55mph open road speed limits, which was bought in in the early 70's to save fuel, many states lifted the limit, and of course so many 'groups' said everyone will die etc etc. Fact is, that year (2003 IIRC) was the lowest road toll in US history, and insurance premiums dropped for the first time in the US.

In the Barossa Valley recently we have had 4 road deaths in seperate crashes in a fortnight. They were all on 100km/h roads, so of course there are heaps of people saying the limits have to be dropped.

They forget to note that 2 deaths were proven suicide and haven't been mentioned in the media since, one death was caused when a car went through a give-way sign and hit the victims car. The 4th one was when an 85year old pulled out onto the Sturt highway in front of a B-double doing 100km/h.

[Malakai]

Old prudes give me the shits.

That is all, carry on.

[Rollin]

Aaron_EF8 - The media never let the truth get in the way of a good story!

I so wish I won the lotto, I'd bloody buy a controlling share in some media outlet (radio, TV, newspaper, I give no fark) and dedicate the rest of my life to drilling proper road safety and road craft into Australian drivers, and getting rid of this 'speed kills' trollop that everyone vomits up on a seemingly weekly basis.

#1 on my list of employees would of course be Mr Tuckey!

[Fairmont888]

Old prudes give me the shits.

That is all, carry on.

LOL i love the straight to the point attitude ya have there

[G3R3N]

The way I see it, there's always been a "hoon" war between cops and "motoring enthusiasts".
This seems to be just another approach the Govt. is taking to scare us and put the pressure on.
In response, you drive harder..

[Airved]

Just remove all speed limits, everywhere. See how that goes! hahaha

[G3R3N]

Just remove all speed limits, everywhere. See how that goes! hahaha

Interesting u say that cos I heard that parts of Germany has removed all street signs and the road toll has fallen significantly since they introduced it about 6 months ago.
Makes u think

[Airved]

They should at least make a rule stating that there are no speed limits in right-hand lanes, especially overtaking lanes

I'm sick of people who are going the speed limit and trying to overtake someone going 2km/hr under - it gets you no where!

Everyone should just drive like dickhead P-platers similar to myself. There'd be a higher road toll, but we'd all get where we want to go quicker

[[Sterling]]

while we are talking about the law, ive got 18"s but if i drive around with 15inch stokkies on the rear is this illigal? i kno it will already atract the cops but is it illigal?