Big Brake kits etc. It's getting boring I know...

by **Malakai** » February 22nd, 2009, 4:38 pm

Does anyone have the means of trying 19x8 AU-BF offset wheels on the UPC 28mm offset brake kit? If so how do they fit?

It shouldn't be far enough out to make too much of a problem.

I think Scorcher has the UPC kit...

Once my car is tuned I'm tempted to just get a UPC kit and some 19x8 AU-BF dark agent wheels and just farken try it. I need new brakes, wheels and tyres all round anyway.

by **Ef_frmnt** » February 22nd, 2009, 5:22 pm

i bet they will fit. get 235 tyres on the front though, the 245s i have look a bit wide

by **67rce** » February 22nd, 2009, 6:50 pm

Malakai wrote:Does anyone have the means of trying 19x8 AU-BF offset wheels on the UPC 28mm offset brake kit? If so how do they fit?

It shouldn't be far enough out to make too much of a problem.

I think Scorcher has the UPC kit...

Once my car is tuned I'm tempted to just get a UPC kit and some 19x8 AU-BF dark agent wheels and just farken try it. I need new brakes, wheels and tyres all round anyway.

I wonder if Revhead can try in on his EB, IIRC he has the UPC kit

by **Malakai** » February 22nd, 2009, 7:04 pm

UPC kit is 28 offset, AU-BF wheels are 35 offset... means that the wheels will only be 7mm too far in, which should clear the upright I think.

Have I got that right?

by **Ef_frmnt** » February 22nd, 2009, 7:31 pm

yep. will go close but will clear. order the tyres 225 on the front for an even bigger safety net..my 20s fitted with a 30mm spacer.

by **krisisdog** » February 22nd, 2009, 8:57 pm

Why the **** do you want 225s on the front??? Smaller tyres is not the answer!!!

by **Ef_frmnt** » February 22nd, 2009, 9:47 pm

you really have no idea what your talking about do you.

go and measure the tread on a 225/35 19 too see how much comes into contact with the road. then measure your 235/45 17 and tell me the difference. then put the figures in your super special "mechanical grip calculator" and while your there tell me the difference in braking distance between two tyres of the exact same brand tread etc but differing from 225 to 235.

by **Rollin** » February 22nd, 2009, 11:15 pm

One thing to note:

Tyre widths are measured across the whole width of the tyre, not just the part normally in contact with the road. Therefore, it is possible to have a 225 tyre that actually has more tread in contact with the road than a 235 - it depends on the 'shape' of the tyre.

by **Ef_frmnt** » February 22nd, 2009, 11:43 pm

which is exactly what im saying. my 225 20s have nearly the exact same footprint as my 245s. and both have more than 235/45 17s

by **Malakai** » February 23rd, 2009, 12:10 am

You guys are correct.

A wider tyre only really adds longitudinal grip with all other measurements in the same proportion. On the other hand it decreases the lateral grip because while it makes the contact patch wider it also makes the contact patch shorter. In the end wether wide or narrow the contact patch stays the same area wise within a 5 to 10 percent error margin.

A wider tyre is good for performance at the limits, they feel steadier, change direction better and provide more feedback from the road because of their wider contact patch and the smaller sidewall that comes with them. A narrower tyre provides a more comfortable ride, dull the feel of the road and offer more flex and bend so changes in direction aren't as direct.

There are only two things that really change the area of the contact patch and they are air pressure and load.

by **Ef_frmnt** » February 23rd, 2009, 10:13 pm

thankyou.
now shoosh about your mechanical grip. you want more go put 28x9' slicks on the front and have them at 7psi.

or just get better brakes

anyone up in qld have one of these kits? i have several sets of wheels we can try to see what fits what doesnt.. 16's 17's 19's 20's....

by **Malakai** » February 23rd, 2009, 10:19 pm

LOL, I would get some of the UPC brakes but it would be pointless putting them on a car that doesn't drive. But not long now.

Paul should have bought the UPC kit.

by **Ef_frmnt** » February 24th, 2009, 8:02 pm

we can still test fit all the wheels. im sick of adaptors and want my 20's back on so this is the only way i can go about it.

i decided dan can help me put a new centre and gears into an au housing to solve the rear part of it

by **mickyyyy** » March 8th, 2009, 2:01 pm

Most of the money is in the machining of the stub axcle to fit the rotors plus brake caliper bits.

This is the order of brake upgrade ill do if i had a choice

BA/BA 296mm rotor with BF twin stop caliper, will be the cheapest as rotors, calipers and pads are cheap and can find them any where. Apparently you can use the Territory rotors and calipers as there sopposed 2 better again. This is a good street kit package

Then 330mm rotor setup and i would just go buy the Race Brakes Sydney kit as there a proven kit and everyone ive chatted to online have great things to say about the kit. This is a good street/race package

We all need to team up and get someone on this forum to make up some kits if we are all genuinly interested. Made to oder basis. Even just machinging the stub axcel and we get the rest of the parts to put it together, id be happy to do that as then i can shop around for the best price on rotors and calipers and pads that i want.

If someone can machine the stub axcel's to fit the below components then ur in buisness and be the cheapest way out of it.

Im going to look into this again when i have the chance and contact another to joints and see if they can do this sort of thing, but we all need to work together and approach any brake joint/fabricator to do this job.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/FALCON-AU-BA-BF- ... 240%3A1318

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=66266

by **Malakai** » March 8th, 2009, 6:47 pm

The trouble is that it costs metric shed loads of money to do it properly. Unless you know what you are doing then it could be dangerous. Also there is a legal and insurance question mark hanging over the whole idea.

by **mickyyyy** » March 8th, 2009, 7:58 pm

Totally agree Malakai and thats why other kits cost 2k

I would like to get away with a upgrade for about $1300.00 using the components rotor and caliper from the link below or use a territory rotor and BF XR caliper, which ever is cheaper as territory rotor is about 330mm but if its only a small cost difference then go territory rotor if its going to reap more benefits.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/FALCON-AU-BA-BF- ... 240%3A1318

by **67rce** » March 8th, 2009, 9:31 pm

I've spoken to Rollin about this, but Crescent Motorsport are slowly working on a brake kit for E-Series, it uses an AU hub, E-Series stub axle 330mm rotors and a Sumitomo 4 Piston caliper off an R32 GTR. this kit gives true AU offset and will be available in due time when Joe at CMS gets time to complete the kit after the 4.8L I6. The kit is expected to retail just under $2k with ADR approval a target

by **LUXO_8** » March 8th, 2009, 9:33 pm

thats the shit! :clapping:

by **67rce** » March 8th, 2009, 9:36 pm

What is better about the kit, Joe has no plans to use a 2 piston caliper, as, in his words, everyone has a 2 piston setup, and a 4 piston kit is over $4k

by **mickyyyy** » March 8th, 2009, 9:51 pm

The kit Joe is doing i think will be over the 2k mark but the problem here is everyone is looking for a cheaper kit. if i had 2k to spend on brake upgrade id buy his 4 spot kit as im paying the same money for a 4 spot kit so im winning for value for money compared to other twin spot kits out there.

He should also have a cheaper kit as there are alot more people that want a cheaper kit than a high end kit so if Joe has 2 kits from both of these people then not only is he winning but we all are.

Thats why when u buy a GPS navigator there isent just 1 model there are 3 or more becuz some people are price consious and some other want to pay more and get bigger screen and what not. Same case here but bigger rotor and caliper.

I still think 322mm rotor with BF XR twin spot caliper or territory rotor and BF XR twin spot caliper will be the cheapest deal to work with.

He is working in conjunction with snort who do all the turbo kits but dont know if snort have anything to do with he brake kit but he has a few things he is working on this year.

I wish him all the best and hope that he brings all these goodies out for us to play with :thumbsup:

by **Rollin** » March 8th, 2009, 11:15 pm

4 piston FTMFW.

Get the kit happening already.

by **Malakai** » March 9th, 2009, 6:41 am

That sounds promising indeed, keep us updated on that kit.

by **mickyyyy** » March 9th, 2009, 8:42 am

If its the same kit that is on Brett's car then yes a shit hot kit. Brett recons 80% better braking power :shock:

I swear with that braking power u need top notch tyres as it will out brake the tyres which isent a good thing but man if u dont have ur belt of ur going through the wind screen hahahaha

Someone should still make a cheaper kit for others out there who are trying to work with a small budget and dont need a massive upgrade like joes and Race Brakes Sydney kit.

cheaoer kit is a Niche market and would be profitable and probably sell 3 to 1 of the more expensive kits.

Mr Spares also known as UPC on ebay has sold 6 kits from 23/SEP - 20/NOV this year, and all were auction not BUY NOW option. So 36 kits sold on ebay a year is not bad. I done a average of what he sold them for and it was $975.83 each kit. After 36 kits sold $35129.88. Not bad for 1 product line. So dont forget 36 kits and only some were buy now option but majority were bidding.

RBS sold a few apparently 30 kits and 5 of them are on ford forums which i chatted to and have all good things to say about the kit.

UPC kit on the other is not the case, i chatted to 3 people and have bad things to say about the product and dosent give a true AU onwards offset.

And for all of you that dont know UPC, joe at cresant motorsport and Furntree gully auto salvage who worked together to get these cheap brake upgrades a while back now. UPC screwed Joe and FTG (Furntree gully auto salvage) and later brought the kit out under his own name which isent that crash hot anyway.

Threads i started to bring back those kits and then found out the story

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7318&p=145712#p145712

http://www.fordmods.com/gearbox-suspens ... 72961.html

So from the numbers there are 42 people interested on 2 forums alone and is only half come to the oarty there is still 20 kits plus ongoing business.

If this info isent enough to get someone to make a cheaper kit then i honestly give up on this subject.

We all as customers should have more choices and i do understand that E series is a small market but hey if u can make 20kits and make urself some money then why not i say.

by **LUXO_8** » March 9th, 2009, 9:23 am

I would just love to see someone make an upright/hub/bracket kit in au+ offset, to which you can fit any ba brakes to

So if you just wanted it for the ofset and a bit better braking you could fit stock ba calipers and rotors, or if you wanted some serious brakes you could grab the brembos and their matching rotors

I really think it would sell well as oposed to a fully fledged kit

by **OED666** » March 9th, 2009, 9:48 am

I bought an RBS kit in August last year. I am happy with it, apart from the fact my ABS no longer works. the CHECK ABS light is starting to piss me off

by **galapogos01** » March 9th, 2009, 9:55 am

How much did the RBS kit cost you OED? And in your other thread I read it was e-series offset? I have an EF so as long as I dont end up with someones "identical" ED uprights my ABS should be OK. I like my current rims and dont want AU offset.

by **OED666** » March 9th, 2009, 11:08 am

Cost a bit over $2000 IIRC. Yes, its e-series offset. If I was you, send them your uprights, (engrave your number plate into them) and get them machined. You'll be without a car for a few weeks though.

by **mickyyyy** » March 9th, 2009, 1:09 pm

Better call RBS and get your ABS sorted as the kit is sopposed to work with ABS

LUXO_8

Im with u on that 1 dude but i dont think many people want to have AU onwards offset

by **mickyyyy** » March 9th, 2009, 1:40 pm

GUESS WHAT GUYS I HAVE A ENGINEER ON BOARD WHO IS KEEN ON MAKING A KIT FOR US

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I'll be going to his workshop on the 21st to play around with some setups and what i need from you guys is this.

used BF XR twin spot caliper
used 322mm BA rotor or territory rotor

He already has a 4 spot willwood caliper with 330mm rotor setup already and has sold over a dozen of them with fantasic performance.

He will get this kit all approved to meet ADR's and kit will be ABS compatible as well.

He asked if we can get a minimum of 5 people on board and put there money were there mouth is and start making them up. Of course he will have 1 on a car tested and get him on this forum and give you guys feedback as he is already a formods forum member who i know.

by **samftr** » March 9th, 2009, 2:18 pm

has anyone fitted the entire k frame from an au into their e series? It might fit, but I could see it being a very big jobbie...
just a thought.

by **EFFalcon** » March 9th, 2009, 5:01 pm

mickyyyy wrote:He asked if we can get a minimum of 5 people on board and put there money were there mouth is and start making them up. Of course he will have 1 on a car tested and get him on this forum and give you guys feedback as he is already a formods forum member who i know.

Estimate on price?

by **EFFalcon** » March 9th, 2009, 5:02 pm

samftr wrote:has anyone fitted the entire k frame from an au into their e series? It might fit, but I could see it being a very big jobbie...
just a thought.

Yes, its been done once or twice, big job.
one person cut/welded the rails.

by **AaronEF8** » March 9th, 2009, 6:29 pm

Yes, its been done once or twice, big job.
one person cut/welded the rails.

It's the only way to do it properly I reckon. All the holes in the E-Series chassis are less than 10mm out from where the AU crossmember bolts need to go, so you'll end up with big funny oval shaped holes everywhere, plus the E-Series chassis has crush tubes like the AU that will all need to be moved, which involves cutting sections of the chassis out to remove them, then welding new parts in to suit the AU mounting holes. I reckon it'll be a lot easier to just weld the AU rails in, like 'macXR6' (or something similar) did. Any decent panel beater can do it.

Lots of people have said that they have engineers looking at E-series big brakes etc etc etc, all you really need to do is look at an E-Series spindle and some BA brakes, and it becomes pretty clear why they don't fit. You have to machine the 'brake pad rests' off the spindles, as well as making the mounting area slimmer to fit the BA brakes, and once that's done, the spindle will be too skinny for a performance application.

If its the same kit that is on Brett's car then yes a shit hot kit. Brett recons 80% better braking power

He can stop from 100km/h in 6m?

by **Rollin** » March 9th, 2009, 6:40 pm

mickyyyy - offset of kit your engineer is building?

by **mickyyyy** » March 9th, 2009, 8:33 pm

AaronEF8

I dont know that he can stop that quick but that was his own words of how much better braking performance so i dont know if its over estimated or not.

Rollin

Were going to do a standard E series offset and AU onwards offset at extra cost

by **samftr** » March 10th, 2009, 8:59 pm

I have had a sticky beak at some race cars out at willowbank, they were using ea's and vn commodores. both appeared to have the same braking system on them. I asked and was told that it was a twin spot hsv brake, but the fella couldnt say what model it was off. next time some of you are out that way have a look, ill try get some pics and measurements etc. might be worth a look into
.

by **Steady** » March 10th, 2009, 9:06 pm

It's a VN Group A caliper from memory, which is the same as an EL GT caliper, which is the same as the AUII premo caliper, which is the same as the Corvette C4 caliper, which is the same as the caliper that Cebco (now Racebrakes) supply to the Saloon cars :grin:

by **samftr** » March 10th, 2009, 10:25 pm

Ahhhh... they seem to cop a fair bit of use out on the track. so we're back to square one...
:hello:

by **mickyyyy** » March 10th, 2009, 10:27 pm

Keep the info coming boys, whatever that may help us

Find out what Disc rotor they are using as well

by **Steady** » March 10th, 2009, 10:34 pm

Mustang 330mm rotor and a custom hub using standard bearings.
Also EL GT rotor can be used, but Saloon cars went away from using them because they were getting better life out of the muzzy floating disc.

I am getting deja vu...

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