Custom lower control arms official EOI. Do it!!

[EFFalcon]

I don't think anyone had the intention when it was posted

would need to get creative with sump/oil pickup unless u went the later model motor.

[braad]

This sounds like a job for BBQburner

Are the sumps different BA -> FG? im assuming yes

[EFFalcon]

yes, FG is rear sumped.

[knowsfords]

Seems the yanks do k-frames all the time... if I had the money I would get a template made up.

[EFFalcon]

yes they do... and they're cheap

[Rollin]

I priced up an FG K-frame and suspension bits and pieces a while back, Around $3500 from Ford for everything except discs and calipers (including rack). The K-frame by itself was only about $500-550 IIRC.

FTG were a bit cheaper, around $2500 I think? Can't remember.

One of my Dads mates is a panel beater and he's keeping an eye out for an FG that's taken a hit in the ass so we can part it out. I did ask him a while back though so he may have forgotten :/

[EFFalcon]

funny, kframe and associated parts are one of those bits that normally goto the recyclers, its amazing what they ask when someone 'wants' one.

[Rollin]

Yeah I reckon. There aren't any FGs at the wreckers up here..I wonder if it would be less if someone went there and pulled the K frame out themselves?

Anyone keen to earn some pocket money?

[EFFalcon]

Self serve wreckers don't have FG's here either.

[BenJ]

Nope, none here in Sydney either.

Even the BA's are few and far between at the self serve places.

Cheers
BenJ

[Rollin]

Yep, it's aids.

What is the go with FTG? Do you just put in an order and then they send you the stuff when they have it? $2500 seems rich for bits and pieces that not too many people would want, and when brand new bits are available from Fraud for only about 30% more.

I'll admit postage is pretty good though - they only wanted $150 for the lot shipped up here.

[nstg8a]

i wouldnt be surprised if the ftg price is for new parts?

[brad_m]

Rollin:
Is there any way you could legally have the morse tapper in the upright machined in from the top so you could flip the rod end and fit it from the other side?
Or bore straight through and have an insert welded in with the taper the other way.

I have seen first hand welding of uprights get passed by an engineer. the car was an EH holden that had a commodore V6 fitted along with a VS steering rack. The in order to fix the bump steer issues and difference in rack width and the track width AND to fit the commodore brakes the uprights were a cut and shut of two holden uprights. Obviously It wasn't just welded and presented for inspection. the whole idea, design and process was presented first and then photo documentation of the actual work and the final part was presented for inspection. (i'm sure the cost for the welding was well over $100/hr)

the car has since been in a number of variety bashes and hasn't had an issue even with flogging they get on unsealed roads.
The guys name is Steve foster, He used to own Fosters Ace Auto here in townsville (sold it to his son) http://www.fostersace.com.au/
He is still contactable through the workshop.
Grumpy old prick but has a brain in his head and might be able to help you, or point you at some one who can.

[wombi90]

I think there not so popular in wreckers because panel beaters can't use second hand parts on cars that are less then 5 years old or something

[Rollin]

Brad - as was mentioned several pages ago flipping the rod end will make the problem atrocious and result in bump steer issues that could be seen from space. The rod end needs to come in from the bottom, but it needs to come in from the bottom about 30mm lower down than it currently does.

[EFFalcon]

offsetting the rack wasnt an option was it?

[brad_m]

Brad - as was mentioned several pages ago flipping the rod end will make the problem atrocious and result in bump steer issues that could be seen from space. The rod end needs to come in from the bottom, but it needs to come in from the bottom about 30mm lower down than it currently does.

OK, for some reason I thought the rod end needed to be higher

[Rollin]

EFFalcon - the rack needed to go up about 30mm, which is impossible as the sump is in the way (not to mention the dramas involved in moving the mounts and trying to get the intermediate shaft to line up etc)

[Parfrey]

Try Diamond auto wreckers in melbourne.. they have a fair few BF's.. might have FG's aswell. Their prices are always decent too.
I can't imagine an FG front end being in high demand?

[MAD]

Reviving this for another thought.

Would a new arm like this resolve the bump steer issue?


No idea about clearances around the upright/sway bar/etc. though.

[tx5_brent]

Your thinking flipping the LCA mount? That wont help bump steer at all, if you flipped the mount of the tie rod end yes, but not the lca. If you were to put longer ball joints in and longer springs you would end up with less bump steer at the same height and your calculated roll centre would be in a better position

[MAD]

The tie rod didn't need to be flipped for this (that would make it tons worse), the tie rod needed to be spaced down. Check out the sketch on pg 5.

If the tie rod needed to be spaced down to correct the bump steer, shifting the ball joint pivot up should have the same effect.

Yeah it will affect other suspension geometry, but depending how much, and what effect it has versus the benefit of brake and wheel options, it might be a worthwhile tradeoff.
Not to mention, if it worked, it would load the lower balljoint in a compressive manner instead of in tension as it is on AU/BA/SY.

[tx5_brent]

ahhh yer, sorry, I replied before reading the whole thread, I thought the tie rod was mounted to the upright the other way around. I see what you are saying and its not a half bad idea.

edit:
for testing sake you could make the lca like this bloke has done, saves lots of moneys in the r&d stage:
http://www.e30m3project.com/e30m3performance/installs/installs-3/control_arms/page2.htm
edit 2:
also, check out the shape of the tie rod in the bmw...

[tx5_brent]

Just an idea,
This page of this build thread shows a pretty dodgey way of correcting the location of the pivot point, I personally dont know if I would trust it and I doubt the authorities would like it. The next page shows a simple method for jigging up a controll arm.
http://www.67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=332026&page=22

[sdoylie]

holy shit that chev set up is nuts. so much fabrication!

chance it might work in this application, though, the whole idea behind this project was to get a reasonably priced lca bolt in upgrade.

you can make anything work with enough $$$ and time.

top marks for the research.

[MAD]

Just an idea,
This page of this build thread shows a pretty dodgey way of correcting the location of the pivot point, I personally dont know if I would trust it and I doubt the authorities would like it. The next page shows a simple method for jigging up a controll arm.
http://www.67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=332026&page=22

If there is room to make something like that, and can be done at a reasonable cost, I think it would be a good solution.

[-fairmont-]

So has anyone taken measurements of the FG k-frame to see if it'll fit E series? anyone want to?

[highkid]

Just an input ... dont know if it will help ... i noticed not long ago that the ba rtv's i think mounted the tie rod end ontop due to the height of the vehicle but cannot remember the overall height of stub axle assembly ... may help ... if it has not been said already.

[MAD]

Just an input ... dont know if it will help ... i noticed not long ago that the ba rtv's i think mounted the tie rod end ontop due to the height of the vehicle but cannot remember the overall height of stub axle assembly ... may help ... if it has not been said already.

That's been suggested already, and it is the opposite of what needs to happen.

[Rollin]

Le Sigh.

[HBWC]

i know bumping a realy old thread

but by the looks it needs a longer tie rod and would a x series type one work? (haven't compared the xh to my xd yet been to wet)
only reason i'm dragging it up as i've just fitted a stubtech drop spindle kit to a mates xe and they supply a 20mm longer tie rod to over come a similar issue for xy onwards falcon's

or what about a screw on extension? i've seen them before but carnt remember where
i also know a little engineering shop local that makes these kind of things local in one offs that if you think it will work and get this rolling again i'm willing to get made and sent to you (they owe me a favor)


if i'm on the total wrong track i'll just shut up and crawl back into my corner

[Rollin]

HBWC - wherabouts do you live? It would be handy if you were in Brisbane.

It's been so long that I can't remember if longe arms were necessary. I think I went and got some AU ones that may have been longer and went straight in.

I'll get back to this one day (I still have the arms and the CNC program to make them) but it's a time and money thing as I'm sure you'd understand.

I do have an FG front end setup sitting in the garage now too, not sure if I'm going to use it though.

[HBWC]

total opposite side of the country unlucky in perth

costs i can understand
and what i meant by longer was the shaft that goes into the upright lowering the pivot point of the tie rod

sounds like we need to start a rollin needs research money fund

[esppwr]

I'll make sure you use that front end Rollin

[Jake]

Rollin, have you finished these yet?

I've got a mate who would love to buy a set.